Peace (salaam alaikum). Where does that leave those who already, in the western countries, have grown up in circumstances other than those of traditional societies? Those who already are outside? Those who may already have children, themselves approaching marriageable age, with no “traditional” Muslim social structure to assist? Are we to say that they are hopeless cases?

I am an “older person” who grew up totally estranged from Islam. Mohammedans [sic!]? They are funny people who have funny names who wear funny clothes and have funny customs who ride camels in the desert and worship somebody peculiar named Mohammed. That was reality to us.

Do I, at my age, have any realistic prospect of an Islamic marriage, especially given the rigid separation of the sexes in so many places, so that I might never meet someone suitable? I suspect not.

One of the realities of life in the west is that many single women literally may not have a Muslim mahram at all! This may be particularly true for female converts. They actually do not have *any* Muslim father, brother, grandfather, uncle, or even son to accompany them. This the same when it comes to a so-called wali for marriage (in the case that they have not been married before). This is reality.

Are they required to go for their entire lives without marriage (and thus children) simply because it becomes impossible to fulfill all the expectations (requirements) laid down by some scholars centuries ago in situations which are so different as to be almost different worlds? Is there not a principle in Islamic law (fiqh) that under some circumstances hardship can alleviate what would otherwise be haraam?

Yes I agree. How the next generation turn out will most likely be dependant on the generation of today. N if the men and women of today do not have the strength to apply Islamic belief to their actions, then we have lost the next generation already. Cannot pass on what we do not practice, if we cannot practice what we preach.

Do not believe there is anything wrong with finding your own partner. Simply the things that are being added along with it -meeting up without a mahram present, excessive phone chats, picture exchanging, crossing the boundaries of ‘halal dating’ for marriage. Modesty is keeping a veil between the opposite sex -includes body covering, covering of words (i.e not speaking very openly), keeping heart and mind clean. That is true hijab -true modesty.

Agreed, it is the reality of the situation. Either keep pure for your Lord and bear the hardships along the way or commit haram expecting it to ‘become halal’ in the end. May Allah save us. Commit haram and then expect Allah’s blessing to be upon that nikkah.

Then that is indeed the fitna…many many Muslims have fallen so low, I have very little hope for the next generation which will say “well how did mum and dad meet, then’ ?

It is purity versus reality.

Peace (salaam). I agree that we might loosely speak of a sort of “crisis” in the ummah, if we do not press things too far. However, with respect to modesty, especially regarding marriage and prospects for marriage, we have to face the reality of affairs in the western countries.

In many traditional Muslim societies, many marriages are arranged, for good or for ill. In the western countries, such marriages are almost impossible for many individuals seeking to marry, and for converts especially. Many/most of them literally have no one to help them find a marriage partner according to traditional norms. They can be literally all alone. A man must find his own wife, and a woman must find her own husband. Indeed, for many converts, their families might outrightly refuse to get involved with family members seeking to marry, and the seekers may know almost no one in the community.

For many people here, engaging in relationships which some traditionalists would consider haram is the only way people have to find mates. Otherwise, they have almost no prospect for marriage at all, and they cannot complete “half their deen.” They remain frustrated and alone. This is the reality of the situation, whether some purists like it or not.

Good reminder indeed.
But let’s be honest, the Ummah is in a total crisis.
In my community, the majority of the married couples met because they had a haram relationship beforehand. Where was the modesty?

The concept of modesty is lost on a huge number of muslims. A seemingly pious man will rather marry a lady who will swap compromising pictures and flirt and be very open with her character. Yet he wants a good muslim wife and believes a lady of little moral before marriage will make a good muslim after marriage. Interest will not be given to a girl who values pardah of her words, heart and physical beauty. Sacred is nikkah, modesty is incumbent before nikkah.
Modesty is the trademark of Islam and it has become tarnished. May Allah forgive us and protect us.

I have a different way of looking at it. I am totally bilingual, and I work with other bilingual (or trilingual) people whose mix of languages is not the same as my two languages. So I’ve kind of lost the sense that there is “my” language and “other” languages.

What happens with this is, now there is very little distinction in my mind between someone inserting into the sentence a word that I don’t know in my own languages because it’s specialised or novel or very old, and one I don’t know because it’s “foreign”. So I just ask what it means. Sometimes it wasn’t necessary to use that word. Sometimes the person is just so used to using the word he doesn’t realise it’s uncommon. Somtimes the person is bilingual and a word in the other language just pops to mind much more readily than in the other – only people who know more than one language (it doesn’t matter which languages as long as it’s more than 1) can understand this! Sometimes actually that word has a very particular nuance that makes it perfect for what he wants to express which a simpler word or a word local to the rest of the sentence just can’t quite convey in a single word. No matter what it is, it’s simply much easier and more enlightening to just ask – what does that word mean? And even a follow-up question, why’d you use that word instead of this one? In this way you have an opportunity to learn something new, remind a brother to explain himself to others better, and learn to welcome diversity in the ummah.

While the point is true that we should make Islam accessible, and that this site is conveyed in English, we should not forget our duty as Muslims to cultivate a sincere interest in nations (this includes languages) other than ours because we have brothers and sisters of the faith in those nations. I think that’s kind of an inseparable part of one’s personal development as a Muslim. Allah made diversity on purpose (I forget which verse), directing us to know one another.